Any critiques, desire for clarity, outright hatred, whatever have you. I will respond the best I can.
I know there’s been some blowback on some of the policy updates but it’s been difficult to really explain fully that the restrictive content policy is temporary, this community was very unmanaged for a time and it had to be reigned in somehow and with the limited tools at disposal the temporary policy changes were made.
Here’s a comment that also explains a little bit behind the decisions made recently as well.
For community mods, we have a community mod coord matrix group chat now. Feel free to DM about it.
Also, there’s another ongoing discussion regarding SFW communities on lemmyNSFW here.
One of my biggest gripes with Reddit as a platform is the overabundance of amateur models spamming every single subreddit with the exact same posts to shill their OnlyFans and Fansly profiles, even to the point of posting their content in irrelevant subreddits without consequence. It’s at the point where the admins have all but abandoned the 10% rule for self-promotion.
Will you be implementing a policy to ban self-promotion for profit (and keep communities like Gonewild purely for exhibitionists), or at least encourage professional content creators to actually interact with the community and not astroturf LemmyNSFW with adverts for their OF like they’ve done with Reddit?
I think it’s mostly up to the community moderators to determine whether or not they want that content and how they will police it. As long as it doesn’t break site rules (new rules and clarification coming soon) then it’s not really something we want to micromanage.
With that said, link spamming is def not ok. I’m open to suggestions on how we can build out the toolchain that can ensure a good quality of posts.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perceptual_hashing
Hash all the images in a separate table and make it searchable. It’s a lot of work but it also makes dealing with DMCA much easier as you can automate removal of obvious infringements and illegal content that’s spreading.
This is what killed nsfw on reddit. All these beautiful, niche subs. Destroyed by of spam. I wrote a bot that scanned a posters history, and if it found an of link, it flagged them. Of course it was banned on reddit.
I am quite time poor to learn a new bot language here at the moment but in time I could give it a crack.
OF spam kills communities.
Based on what evidence?
As a mod of many subs on Reddit, what I saw killed a lot of the subs over thepast year is the proliferation of spam accounts that repost popular posts indiscriminately within a sub (OC, seller, doesn’t matter) in order to advertise products/websites, etc via pinned posts on their profiles. Plus the Reddit admins allowing “viral” subreddits to spring up on a daily basis by these spam rings.
Most competent mods on legit subreddits knew how to use automod and verification tools to handle sellers, etc. What drove a lot of us mods to throw up our hands and close off subreddits is the fact that we got no support from admins to combat spam/spammers (not the same as sellers).
And of course, at the same time, Reddit banned a lot of long time experienced moderator accounts which then resulted in many niche subreddits to be banned due to lack of moderation. From my viewpoint, the culprit is not due to sellers.
[Addition] - Just old history for reference
I wrote a bot that scanned a posters history, and if it found an of link, it flagged them. Of course it was banned on reddit.
Haha - what a coincidence! I was part of the ones that reported to Reddit admins such bots like the one you wrote so that those bots would be banned 😉 (and they were)
[Addition] rip onlyfansdetectbot, https://imgur.com/LrQhZv6, Full album for related screenshots wrt bot - https://imgur.com/a/tfqTKLg
I wholeheartedly and respectfully disagree. I used to visit the communities, let’s say /r/assholebehindthong or something like /r/assontheglass. It was a true community full of people who were into that particular fetish. It was smaller, traffic was not as fast, but the posts were quality. Pure quality.
Now it’s a non stop stream of:
- do you like my (insert appendage)
- my husband won’t fuck me, will you?
- upvote for nudes in your inbox
- etc etc etc
Total clickbait spammy shit. You’ll visit a subreddit like /r/doublevaginal and you’ll get an OF spammer posting an image that has nothing to do with DV and a title like “would you like to double vag me?!”.
The subreddits have been laid waste to the scourge of OF spamming. I yearn for the days when the subreddits were actual, real people posting real, focused content. It’s done, it’s gone and it’s nearly 100% OF material that’s killed it.
I totally understand the frustration you and many others have. It’s easy to simply point at sellers and say they are the cause - its so convenient to scapegoat.
in my reply earlier, ive laid out some of my observations (over 5 years) about the decline. A sub/community’s health and success is almost totally based on the moderator teams and whether they actually care about what they are moderating vs if they just want to build/expand little fiefdoms for ego reasons. And believe it or not, the community members play a huge part in reporting and weeding out spam and keeping the playground clean if mods motivate them and take action on reports.
As mentioned, most of the usual clickbait can and is easily handled by automod as well as by moderators who can lay out a vision and set reasonable rules for the community, as well as judicious banning. Talented sellers know how to properly focus on what the community want and deliver (without the clickbait). As an example, I took over r/LabiaGW for a couple of years from the founder of sub and grew it from 100K to 500k in that time (with the help of a healthy mix of true amateurs AND verified responsible sellers). The clickbait sellers don’t last long beyond a few days and are easily banned/weeded out by the community.
Unfortunately, Reddit allowed (explicitly encouraged?) spamrings to flourish and exist because it needed the traffic from such to keep showing subscribers and traffic “growth” metrics (likely for advertising and planned IPO purposes). Mods had to spend majority of the time fighting THAT spam so couldn’t focus on actually “moderating” and cultivating the communities. Reddit also banned/removed a lot of such responsible mods (or some mods just threw up their hands at lack of inaction about spam from Reddit admins and left the mod teams), and then these subs got taken over by shady folks who purpose is simply to promote and actively provide forums for the spam stuff you mentioned. Try looking at various mods/rings that currently “operate” the subs full of the spam you abhor, vs the successful subs that remain relatively clean and are growing. Ask yourself why Reddit admins allow hese shady folks to flourish even when repeatedly reported, but actively seek out to remove ban responsible mods who do such reporting…
I hope Lemmy admins are reasonable and smart enough to recognize the true causes and don’t knee-jerk ban sellers.
Yeah but at this point they’re probably helping growth since they post so much actual content, so I think having a light hand towards them is beneficial. Still should be in the proper subs though.
Would love to see the photon UI deployed.
100%, we will implement it when we can :)
Yay!
While I’m not sure if there’s anything that can be done about it, I really don’t like that I’m able to see who reported my content. By not having the reporters be anonymous, it leaves a gateway for people to be harassed by others for making completely legitimate reports.
I’m not sure how likely it is that a case like this has happened already, but as the community grows, we’re bound to see people who are here in bad faith.
I am all for making sure for rules to be enforced, however…
I have been collecting images I like from the R site for however many years, and now, with a new site and community, I am ready to share the love.
I’ve started posting, but !tinytitties@lemmynsfw.com have been kind of unwelcoming. First, they asked for model consent on a post, which was promptly deleted anyway. No big deal, let’s choose something that doesn’t look like I want to share some revenge porn. Another one deleted, now I am banned for even subscribing.
The rules are not clearly specified. I’ve posted to some other communities with no problem, but there is no rule about having to provide source, consent, or OC name. This is something that has to be worked on a little.
I get the reasoning, but I do feel that the rules are Way too strict on artwork (as opposed to pics/video of real people) to an unprecedented level. I’d like to see that reevaluated to be more in line with what other sites that allow NSFW permit - if they were facing legal trouble over that content, then they would ban it too, so I think it’s pretty evident that they don’t.
In particular this whole concept of establishing a “canon age” for every character and disallowing aged-up art strikes me as much worse than simply disallowing any art that looks underage.
I’d also like some clarity on how broad this goes.
Is captioned-in non-consent dialogue also prohibited? What about live action scenes with actors who are verified 18+ but have no curves and look young? Original art with unspecified age? Monster girls from species that don’t even live to 18?
There’s a lot there and it’s above and beyond virtually anywhere else. If this is part of the idea of broad, temporary restrictions as an attempt to reduce the admin workload, really what it’s going to do is create a lot of little fires to stamp out when the focus needs to be on the things that will get the site shut down the fastest (obviously illegal content and DMCA violations). Best to keep it simple, and simple is following established standards. Even if it means allowing content admins personally don’t like.
I agree. These rules only increase moderator workload, which really only contributes to burnout when the moderation tools aren’t good.
I wanted to express that I’m extremely concerned about the banning of @paddedperson and the deletion of their thread saying that they were migrating away from lemmynsfw.
As far as I can tell, @paddedperson was banned for leaking preliminary information about upcoming content policy changes from the admin discussion group. In my view, they were legitimate concerns, and retaliatory action taken against him are very concerning with respect to treatment of whistleblowers.
Can admins comment on this incident?
Truly transparent non-profit organizations (e.g. Wikipedia) typically release meeting minutes (a summary or transcript), or allow the public to attend voting meetings as part of the audience. Can the admins provide a summary or transcript of the votes taken on various decisions?
So I’m not really an “admin” - I’m a sysadmin/developer who was given the role of admin so I can make sure all systems (including modlog, reportings, and other tools) work as we adjust them for this instance’s very specific needs.
Padded got banned because he was trying to sabotage the efforts of an entirely volunteer group including revealing our hosting provider. We are not a “non profit organization” - lemmynsfw is a volunteer instance being run on donations. People need to understand that this is no one’s “job” and yet it’s literally taking a ton of our time. I’ve spent so many hours pouring over lemmy code, system configurations, working with the mod tool group, brainstorming, writing code, and trying to help the real admins where I can…
And seriously, no one is being paid for this, donations barely cover server costs, and any excess donations are being saved because it’s anticipated that server costs will continue to rise while donations don’t. Besides, I don’t think any of us WANT to be paid for fear of reprisal from our respective governments for “making money” off serving pornography.
When the creator put out his call for help, a bunch of us stepped up to try to keep the server alive, but this is not an easy instance to run. Please understand that.
To be clear, the volunteers/admins at Wikipedia are not paid either. From my personal experience in Wikimedia communities, my sincere advice is to consider and take transparency seriously.
The most important resource in volunteer spaces like this is ‘trust’.
I hope you and the admin team recognize that in order to run a website like this, you also require the trust and buy-in from moderators (who are also unpaid) to invest the many hours into their communities just as you have done for the server. Hiding things from moderators, sending mixed messages, and making secret deliberations (with rumors that some admins are eager to remove large quantities of content) is really damaging for that relationship of trust.
The recent content policy changes (even before padded’s leak) have been dictatorial top-down decrees. However, these unilateral rule changes are impractical/meaningless when moderators have not agreed to enforce those rules – and I’ve personally experienced this (at best, only 30% of the content that I’ve reported for content policy violations have been addressed by moderators). Realistically, no moderator wants to enforce rules they don’t believe in, and if they leave, the departure of skilled talent cripples this website and leaves communities effectively unmoderated in practice.
Please consider improving the transparency of these content policy deliberations, and at the very minimum, incorporate community moderators into the discussion and ascertain that they are in agreement with the rules before rolling out changes on the drop of a dime.
Please don’t allow communities to ban sellers. I think not allowing advertising in the community itself makes sense. I shouldn’t get excluded for having a fan site though! It’s incredibly entitled to expect girls to post nudity with no way to profit off of it. Give the good talent a reason to post on this platform 💘💘💘
Give the good talent a reason to post on this platform
I totally agree with you. OC/seller talent is always welcomed at communities I moderate (with the exception of ones that are strictly studios/sites focused).
IMO, Reddit (and the subreddits I mod) benefited so much from the creative sellers.
I appreciate that 💘 On Reddit, some mods banned me for having a link in my bio on my own page. That seemed over the top to me.
I fully support your right to promote and make a living with your content. But there must be the possibility for people to create coms exclusively for exhibitionists that like to post for the thrill of it. These people has as much right to have a platform as you have. Mods are also literally working for free to keep coms safe, on topic and legal. Everyone should feel welcome on this site. (as long as they are following the rules and laws, of course) Let’s find a way to exist well alongside each other. :)
I’ll just chime in to say that while I have no problems with sellers (and all the amazing sex workers out there!), so many of these communities seem to be nearly overrun with people marketing content. I just want to be able to know when people are selling, and choose that kind of content, when it appeals to me.
Specifically, there’s an entirely different feel to for-profit porn versus for-excitement porn, and I, for one, am hoping for a little more space being made specifically for people in it for the fun - I’m thinking like /r/NoFans and /r/normalnudes for example.
I’ve always advised OC sellers to stay away from those subreddits and mod teams that run those fiefdoms (and I’m sure the same division lines will emerge here on Lemmy).
There are/will be many other welcoming places where you will be appreciated. And you can always create new vibrant communities yourself)
That’s fair. I read your site rules and I appreciate the emphasis on consent. I guess it was alarming to me to see that as a growing trend on Reddit & Reddit culture
Not sure if this belongs here but…
Does every celebrity or porn star really need their own community?
Was browsing by new and almost every celebs post had a duplicate in the ultra specific community just for that one celeb.
Yeah… Noticed that. I don’t like it, but that said won’t it be up to the users to see what survives and takes root?
I’d rather they didn’t exist, but at the same time the freedom of this kind of platform might be compromised if mods just start shutting down communities as they see fit.
I’m split 50/50 on this.
won’t it be up to the users to see what survives and takes root?
I would agree, but all these celeb communities is making lemmynsfw nigh-unusable for me. Right now, they make up well north of 90% of all communities on this instance, meaning the front page is devoid of any other content unless one uses subscribed-only view or blocks them all.
Being able to one-click block communities from the communities list would help a lot.
Edit: Nevermind, I’m dumb - Hadn’t enabled ‘Show NSFW’ in settings. Still, I don’t see why the celebs can’t just all go in /c/celebs.
I just made a post after discovering all the local communities. If you’re interested you can check this post.
Still, I don’t see why the celebs can’t just all go in /c/celebs.
Then, the same logic is applied to other duplicate subject communities. Age, pussy, hentai, pornstar, asian, bdsm, tits, dick, cosplay, cum, femdom, freeuse, girls, hair, indian, nsfw, onlyfans, porn, sexy, sissy, tiktok, etc. All this subject has multiple communities not just one.
I’m sure as lemmy’s grows also this instance (this instance barely one month, btw) we will have new features to take care of all of this and create users’ the best experience. The fact maybe I started early and they growing/active fast, they will appear first when you explore communities.
I hope sorting communities will be available soon. I need that too
the same logic is applied to other duplicate subject communities
Yeah, that’s fair. I don’t have a problem with specialized communities, and I agree that better filtering tools is the way to go.
Until those tools are available though, perhaps you could slow down a little on opening new communities? Take a look at the front page in logged out mode and you’ll see what I mean.
perhaps you could slow down a little on opening new communities? Take a look at the front page in logged-out mode and you’ll see what I mean.
Because a guest only sees SFW stuff. Mostly dominated by us that post Celebrities and do not necessarily mark communities as NSFW. Discovering local communities is now sorted by active users. If a lot of non-celebrities posters actively post/comment and their communities will get higher spots. Btw, it’s only a few of us who post celebrities, I can say with all these communities I’ve only moderated approximately 10-15 posts/day. Maybe less, if me or @SushiMage@lemmynsfw.com doesn’t contribute
