Thanks! I talked to one one-on-one and I think we got to the bottom of some of it (was trying to force homebrew their class to fit their idea of it/bring it up to the power level they feel it should be) and made some compromises. I think (hope lol) I put my foot a little down they’ve gotten a version they can live with and we’re not going to keep adding things on. And that we are not a wargaming table.

Awkward talk, but hopefully we can patch any uncomfortable feelings as we go forward or, if not, at least part amicably like you said.

Yeah I think that’s it exactly re: more. As DM I’m like okay it’s one thing enough. I didn’t see the laundry list behind.

And thanks! That’s a good idea, see where it gets us.

That’s a good point. I know they said they want deadly combat, but one has also said they hate when the enemy is hard to hit and they’re not doing damage/having their damage mitigated. I think it probably is just about doing cool stuff and big damage and they’re not wording it well.

The group is specifically to run an AL so we won’t be switching systems. But I do think I have to think about how important the balance is to me (I’m not really sure, I’m mostly just here because the constant requests to be more OP are getting to me lol).

Thanks for the insights.

Thanks! For the doc and the encounter building, but also about the expectations. I’ve been getting badgered so much (like, solid month when I said no to something) about “what about if I did it this way” “you have to allow it if I do it this way!” “It would be so great if I could just be this OP!” it has really worn me down and made me feel like the asshole draconian DM for saying no. So that’s a really good point. I did give in and it’s still not enough. So I think that’s definitely where I need to launch this talk from. Measuring their expectations to mine and enjoying a measured game.

Far as encounter building I’m definitely having difficulty because our sessions aren’t that long so we can fit four combats max. There’s rp challenges in there too, but most of the players are around to roleplay so that’s what we mostly end up doing. One player has said (when it was mentioned the OPs want deadly combat) they would absolutely hate that kind of session which tracks since they’re really into roleplay. I think making the first encounter or two mooks and then having the rest be glass cannon bosses would probably be best. I was just worried because the rest of the party isn’t built to be OP so I’d be focusing most attacks on the OP players and I don’t want the rest to feel left out.

No, it’s more asking for actions to be free actions or magic items to just be given to them. I said no a lot initially and they tried to wrangle the party and NPCs into doing it for them/letting them get these non-RAW things (trying not to be specific, but at one point they tried to use the NPC they were rescuing as a free whole extra set of action economy). So I’ve felt compelled to just give it to them so they stop derailing the session. My bad really turned out to be giving in as it ramped the asking up a ton and also wanting RAW rules to now apply because they got non-RAW things they want to abuse against the enemies (so even though it was explained to me it was wanted for X and I agreed to X specifically, they’re bringing up RAW also gives them Y and Z).

Eta: little more specific so NPCs and the party were all being repeatedly badgered to do actions for them instead of being played themselves. Every time I said no it would switch to the next character they interacted with. Same thing for magic items they wanted. It was just constant trying to work every angle to have it show up and be given to them. I’d say no you can’t buy a vorpal sword and it’d become maybe this guy has a vorpal sword in his house for no reason, let’s check till one shows up. That kind of stuff. (They do not have a vorpal sword but as a hypothetical scenario this is what I’m dealing with)