That is terrible. Obviously for both sides, but this is on another level. I feel bad for all the innocents that are slaughtered, and are going to be slaughtered because of this.
I reckon it’s going to get decently worse before it gets better unfortunately.
I agree. This pot has been on and off the boil for decades, this latest boil over will be going for a while. I feel sickened by the thought of the news from the region in the coming weeks.
Did you read the article? This is absolutely not the time for “both side” ism. It’s time to condemn a clear atrocity.
I did and said it was on another level. Did you not read my comment?
To what end? What sorts of events are more likely to occur if the entire western world decides that these were subhuman attacks and does not taint the condemnation with warnings of retributive death tolls?
You likened this to someone questioning 9/11 in another comment, and that’s very right. After 9/11 the idea that “the Taliban” did atrocities and urging restraint was offensive led to 20 years of war and hundred of thousands of dead. When war fever is rising, the correct response is to tamp it down, not castigate people for saying “this is terrible, but we shouldn’t slaughter innocent people”.
The end is that babies were mass murdered. That is unequivocally BAD. And universally terrible. It’s something evil that, let’s say Nazis, terrorists do.
Sure. And what does that have to do with not questioning the death of babies Israel is inflicting in response?
And there’s the “what about”ism.
Yeah… no. Killing babies is bad period mmmkay.
That someone would mention the literal killing of babies by Israel is the whole fucking thing you were objecting to. Sorry to intrude on your righteous war fever with the small issue that the response is literally doing the thing you say is “bad period”.
OP’s (and my) stance is that killing babies is bad, period. You’re the one who seems unhappy that the tragedy you want to think about is being related to the actual killings or children that are ongoing. They’re both fucking horrible, but you don’t seem to think the Palestinian children are also innocent and deserve to live as well.
“These are monsters and don’t talk about what we’re doing in response” is the cry of the warmongers lusting for retribution.
“worry you can’t point out the literal war crimes of one side of this three sided war, because one of the other three sides also commits them”
And if you point out the hypocrisy, you’re a nazi or anti-semite. Because apparently the government and military of the country of Israel represents ALL jews.
And I guess bothering to point out that the situation isn’t a simple “take out one group and MAGIC PEACE!” solution that people seem to be implying. Plus the fact that anybody slightly questioning the official story gets shit on when the official story is basically the exact excuse the GOVERNMENT (not the people) of Israel has been waiting for to get what they want, and have made no secrets about for decades.
Maybe if we hadn’t stuck our collective noses in it for the last 80 years, they’d be a lot better off.
Leaving this from the Reddit thread, since it was put so well:
I look forward to seeing how this is excused, justified, and quietly cheered on by some of our fine members. No doubt the babies were “guards” in the “open air prison” and were in fact apartheid babies.
And hey, you can’t blame people for murdering dozens of babies, as long as those people have hard lives. And of course being known as the sort of people who would murder a bunch of babies has NOTHING to do with why they have hard lives.
Edit: Ok so far the top winners are, in no particular order:
“They had it coming”
“I’m not saying that they had it coming, but they had it coming.”
“Give peace a chance.”
And my favorite, the short lived “It didn’t happen.”
Add this one to your list: “Hamas is the monster Israel created.”
I feel horrible for the children, but I assume this level of violence is happening due to the fact that these “border communities” are the houses/land/farms the Israelis have been strait up stealing from Palestinians lately… saw a video of them just throwing a family out on the street and stealing their house for, whatever bullshit reason they had. Israel has been taking people’s homes and lives for decades expanding their borders illegally.
No one should murder children. But you probably shouldn’t steal people’s homes and put children in them.
That would be in the west bank, not Gaza. Gaza has very steady borders and no encroachment for a long time and Gaza is where the attack came from.
I admire that you’ve come with facts. Hopefully people will actually learn rather than parrot the narrative.
Like, Iran and Syria planned this. They literally gas their own people. They just brutally attacked hundreds of innocent people. How is Lemmy apologizing a clear atrocity? How can you be so frickin callous and blind to the hate?
It’s like going to New Yorkers on 9/11 saying, “yeah, it was inevitable” and then blaming Wall Street or some sort of thing.
I feel horrible for the children, but
There should be no ‘but’ when talking about the murder of children and leave it at that!
I feel like Lemmy is at a critical junction of its future development and sentiments like these are what turn people away.
Lemmy had truly shown an ugly side these last few days, it’s sad to see.
Lemmy has shown that it understands that Israel murders more innocents and children. Israeli genocide is cool tho, gotcha.
Just a sickening world view but you exemplify it well.
A swing and miss bro, but at least you tried your best to whatabout/bothsides 👍
(see other comment on Gaza vs. West Bank)
And just like that, my last shred of sympathy is gone. Fuck Palestine.
Already ~260 Palestinian children have been killed. That number is only going to go up. No sympathy for them? What about sympathy for the Palestinians living under the rule of Israel and Hamas who haven’t had a real election in almost two decades, and whose oppressors can be best described as ‘bad’ (Israel) and ‘worse’ (Hamas)?
People miss this like it’s some ideological struggle. Like siding with Palestine or Israel inherently are causes with some abstract values attached to them. They’re not, not at their core. It’s just a blood feud. It’s just one big, abhorrent, ugly blood feud with no end in sight.
We should have listened to Hannah Arendt.
What the hell are you even talking about. You’re just using talking points.
Media loves Palestinians. Guess what - Hamas, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, they all love when you conflate them with the poor Palestinians. But they are separate. Palestinians get screwed by Hamas, etc. Western media coverage is deeply problematic. You should know this by now with all the disinformation campaigns online the past 7 years.
To answer your question, there is a shitload of sympathy for them. But you don’t get to do unrepentant violence. Raping and murdering babies.
Please do not ignore Palestinian leaders who steal aid from their own people, brainwash their children to hate Jews, and spout rhetoric that the Jews caused the Holocaust.
Please do not reduce it to a blood feud. It only shows you’re a morally outraged outsider and got no clue. This is hate and racism. It’s middle eastern politics. It’s a proxy war, and it’s a tale of having democracy in a deeply corrupt and autocratic region.
The best thing you can do is stay out of it and stick to your peaceful talking point. Because that’s what we need. Not more uneducated “advocates.” It serves no one.
Media loves Palestinians. Guess what - Hamas, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, they all love when you conflate them with the poor Palestinians. But they are separate. Palestinians get screwed by Hamas, etc. Western media coverage is deeply problematic. You should know this by now with all the disinformation campaigns online the past 7 years.
Didn’t realize those 260 children were secret Hamas-Iranian-Syrian-Lebanese agents. I apologize.
To answer your question, there is a shitload of sympathy for them. But you don’t get to do unrepentant violence. Raping and murdering babies.
Don’t know where I said that was okay, but go off, I guess.
Please do not ignore Palestinian leaders who steal aid from their own people, brainwash their children to hate Jews, and spout rhetoric that the Jews caused the Holocaust.
Again, I don’t know where I said otherwise, but keep tilting at that windmill.
Please do not reduce it to a blood feud. It only shows you’re a morally outraged outsider and got no clue. This is hate and racism. It’s middle eastern politics.
… what exactly do you think a blood feud is, if not hate and racism? I’m curious.
It’s a proxy war, and it’s a tale of having democracy in a deeply corrupt and autocratic region.
That’s some ‘they hate us for our freedumbs’ level post-9/11 spirit, right there.
You’re beyond out of touch. Are you from the region?
Would you call systemic racism in the USA a blood feud? Would you call white supremacy a blood feud? I think all the words you’re using don’t mean what you think they mean.
Decades of oppression, povertyv isolation and killing turns people into monsters.
if you were to take a phalastinian child and put him/her in a peaceful/loving environment surely they would become an ideal citizen.
Solution is peace as it has always been.
You don’t even need to take them out of Gaza. There are 2 million people there and Israel estimated 1000 of them took part in the attack. Decades of oppression turns a tiny sliver into murderous extremists, and yet the whole area gets the retribution.
Look, I’m angry too. It’s a difficult time to be Jewish because there is a boat load of antisemitism and hate online. And in person.
Apparently it’s not cool to hate black or Asian people, but it’s totally cool to hate Jewish people, even when it’s a thread about how terrorists literally mass murder their babies. No one is saying they are sorry. They are saying poor Palestinians.
Pretty fucking callous.
But let’s not lose sight there are folks caught between radicalism. Blanket statements help no one.
For every Israeli child that dies dozens of Palestinians do. One side has wealth and control of the narrative on an international level. I’m sure if Palestinians would get a lot more stories about all the bodies of the dead children if Israel didn’t have an iron grip on Gazas borders and allowed journalists near the ditches they stack the bodies up in.
Hamas, if it was a grownup organization, would have built bomb shelters for the innocent civilians it governs. Instead, it stockpiles arms among civilian buildings, and has it’s own tunnels for safety and benefit of its well-armed, well-off people- not the Palestinians. It left the Palestinians out to dry- not letting them know it was attacking, then receding back to the safety of their tunnels while their stockpiles in civilian buildings got blown up with all the poor people. It’s using them as a human shield.
Terrorist orgs and warlords never give a fuck about their populace. They serve to only enrich themselves and their allies.
Yes, the poor people with very limited resources should of built better infrastructure. A classic and well thought out argument.
Hamas is an evil terrorist organization. I don’t think anyone here is saying otherwise, and I assume that’s a truth you fully agree with.
So we all agree, they’re evil. How does that excuse the killing of Palestinian civilians? It would be great if the terrorists thought about the good of their fellow man, but we’ve all recognized that they’re bad guys, so it’s pretty expected they’re not going to do what’s good for their people, but that doesn’t change that a bunch of people who are not Hamas are currently being killed by Israel.
