I always disliked RCS, I kept telling people it’s a walled garden, mainly controlled by Google
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Jibe is RCS. They are so dominant all other implementations will have to follow. So far only Google, Samsung and soon Apple can actually implement RCS practically.
Where I live there’s a single ISP which doesn’t use Jibe. RCS is largely Google, and this likely won’t change with iPhones supporting RCS.
I agree. You’re much better off just using Signal. It’s not federated/decentralized, but all client apps, the protocol and the server code are completely open source and anyone can fork the project. It also works on every platform, its encryption protocol is the most secure one out there and it’s been around for over 10 years. They also recently added some cool new privacy features.
Ok good. But then there’s the problem of actually convincing people to use Signal. A messaging app is pointless if nobody else wants to use it.
Even so you’d think they’d want to get as many people as possible on board with RCS to increase adoption, not fewer.
Then what they’re doing tells us all we need to know.
Google wants to control what data they can glean from RCS users.
This is Google’s end game messaging app. They want to replace text messaging and Google hangouts/allo/chat… were never going to cut it.
Its a chat app that doesn’t look like one. It looks like the default sms app, you don’t need anyone to download or make an account for it. There biggest hurdle was getting iOS users. They’ve now pressed apple into supporting it as well. They even have Apple state Google will help with their installation. We know Google pay apple billions every year to keep Google search the default on iOS, it even binds Apple to publicly and in court support the arrangements. I wouldn’t be surprised if Google has paid billions just for RCS on iPhone. It will keep their marketing monopoly in place for a long time.
Good standard you have there. Good features are proprietary to Google and you can’t use it while rooted.
Lmao
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We really need to move away from the idea that a user having control over his/her device is insecure.
I can use online banking and paypal with windows logged in as administrator or GNU/Linux logged in as root[0], why shouldn’t I be able to use google
walletpaywallet with root?[0] yes I know you shouldn’t log in as root, but that doesn’t change that you can do it.
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I must be missing something. How would Google be at all liable for restoring funds stolen by software that they themselves didn’t furnish, on a device that’s out of their control?
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is now forced to work until they die
As if that’s not already the case
A judge may not see it that way. They may perceive it as Google failing to provide adequate protections to their users.
If user installed the app created by Google and did not share any login credentials. It’s easy to claim Google is liable.
The equivalent would be a bank leaving the back door to their vault open. An intruder going in and removing your funds. Despite following all the banks instructions, the bank has not replaced the funds.
The banks is responsible for people gaining unauthorised access to your account. Especially when you don’t share your login credentials with anyone (even unknowingly). If they can’t protect against root access attacks then, they shouldn’t permit use of their app on those devices.
Apps have convenience features, especially related to easy sign in. Their website logins don’t have these features. They require the user to enter passwords, challenge codes, card reader etc. If someone gets access to a password manager, the user is at fault. The bank likely stated you shouldn’t write down or record your password.
Tried installing the most recent WhatsApp update but it’s failing. I think a virus is blocking the update, better try again with secure browsing off…
how would an unrooted but old, deprecated version of android be any better than an updated custom rom?
those things baffle me, they just want to take away control dont they?
I’m not even rooted and gpay keeps breaking on crdroid for me, despite passing safetynet. I’ve given up and just got another credit card that I can use with my garmin watch that works every time without the hassle.
No my friend, our overloads have decided that you shouldn’t have control over your desktop either.
“why shouldn’t I be able to use google wallet pay wallet with root?” Because little innocent Google won’t be able to build their advertising profile of you. Can’t have that!
Does rooting your device make you the root user or just gives you access to superuser utilities?
In linux systems the root user shouldn’t be used for daily use, you just make an user account with permission to use sudo, doas or su.
If you root your phone, at least with most tools, you don’t become the root user. Apps that use root access have to request it, and you’ll have to allow it in the root tool you flashed.
Example pop-up from SuperSU:
So google is lying about rooted devices, they seem as secure as an OEM letting an user sideload apps or google themselves letting malware apps inside their store
Lol. So if you use an exploit to gain SU what makes you think a malicious app can’t do the same? Or better yet, find a new exploit in the SU management software you installed. As soon as you root, you can no longer guarantee root activities are not taking place unbeknownst to you…
if you use an exploit to gain SU what makes you think a malicious app can’t do the same
They can. 99% of computer security is still not installing malware or being tricked into taking actions that enable your own harm. That said often rooting methods involve physically pressing keys while booting to access the boot loader, ADB, running things with with expansive permissions. Malicious apps install via play store with reasonable permissions will generally have a much harder time breaking out of the sandbox.
Or better yet, find a new exploit in the SU management software you installed
Historically “sudo” tools haven’t been the source of many issues whereas a multitude of problems flowed from complex memory unsafe code.
As soon as you root, you can no longer guarantee root activities are not taking place unbeknownst to you
You can never guarantee this however if you are careful what you install you will remain safe same as it was before.
Yeah, I’m going to get downvoted into oblivion for this…
I’m sick and tired of reading this same uneducated argument. Your desktop browser and an app on your phone are entirely different paradigms security/development wise.
Your desktop browser is expected to be insecure. Nobody stores data there besides cookies. Most processing happens somewhere else on a server.
Apple and Google have changed this stance entirely because they knew apps could be a lot more powerful if they did. The API’s that exist to build apps on your phone are designed around the concept of having a secure, sandboxed environment per app. Apps can run offline and manipulate data quickly because data can be synced down and stored locally. I know it sucks for rooted users, but I don’t blame developers for refusing to support those devices one bit.
The standard seems to be complete and utter garbage. It was garbage from the very beginning, which is why I never understood why people were getting so incredibly hyped up about RCS support.
I don’t know why, but that a sad news :/
Good news.
The more people they keep from using this garbage “standard”, the better.
It still requires a phone number. It still falls back to SMS, it still fails, a LOT - just see the comments in this thread.
It’s 20 years too late.
XMPP was better, in 2010, than RCS is today. I was using XMPP on my phone in 2010, messaging people on computers, seamlessly. Without a phone number. On multiple services using Pidgin.
No thanks, I don’t want this garbage called RCS.
I don’t get the RCS hype. I already have apps for rich messaging and RCS offers nothing for me over those apps. What I do appreciate is SMS, which is posed to be killed-off by RCS. I can rely on SMS even when there is no data signal, can’t say that for RCS. I wish I had a way to permanently disable RCS on my Pixel 6a, instead I have to keep rejecting the ‘upgrade to RCS’ dialog.
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Every day I am attracted more and more by PinePhone. At least as a secondary device, at first.
Perhaps it’s not even close to polished yet with existing distributions, but at least it isn’t made to be shitty.
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No. I genuinely doubt it ever will… Huge pinephone stan here but I don’t see it happening. And before you make the purchase… Please be sure you know what you’re getting into… I’m so sick and tired of folks popping in the chat rooms asking how to install android. We’re actually dealing with a lot of spam lately due to a clearly butt hurt person…
This is shitty, but genuinely I have no idea why people root or run custom ROMs these days. I haven’t found an actual use for it since about 2015
Edit: plenty have people have given me fair enough reasons now, thanks
You want an example? GrapheneOS, to take back my privacy.
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Less bloat ware/spy ware - custom ROMs don’t come prepackaged with random shady games from shady companies or random shady social media apps from shady social media companies.
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Better privacy and security implementations along with DeGoogling - a lot of ROMs offer Gappless ROMs which is really important since Google is way to big and has too much influence on android OEMs and its easily the biggest ad company in the world and constantly refused to respect peoples privacy. e.g GrapheneOS https://grapheneos.org/features and DivestOS https://divestos.org/
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Long term software support to help against e-waste e.g LineageOS supports so many phones who’s manufacturers have stopped supplying software updates. https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/
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Customization e.g Crdroid includes loads of custom settings from a variety of other custom ROMs and OEM ROMs that rarely get implemented by any stock ROMs. https://crdroid.net/
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Rooting android phones gives users the ability to access system files that they may not have been able to backup if the apps don’t support it. It also allows for a full system backup and restore
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It also allows users to block ads and unwated connections without using a local VPN e.g adaway
Enabling Google to dictate what a user can do with their own device by limiting features is a slippery slope and the last thing we want to happen is for Android to end up like iOS with its walled garden approach.
You can still install custom roms without root enabled. Enabling root access is an optional step on most custom roms installation as long as your bootlooader has been unlocked. The question is, does google disable rcs on such devices too, or is it just on rooted devices?
As of 2024, Google is now quietly blocking RCS messages on unlocked/rooted android devices. Even if your device only has an unlocked bootloader, it is now at risk of being quietly shadowbanned from sending RCS text messages.
According to the OP that opened the issue with Google, it doesn’t work with devices with unlocked bootloaders so it would affect the majority of custom ROM users since very few custom ROMs and devices support relocking the bootloader, and I think it probably would still affect these devices too since the last time I relocked a bootloader with DivestOS I still had the error message about system integrity on boot
Rooted users can probably bypass this issue with some Magisk modules the same way they do with GPay and banking apps.
If Google really does want to push RCS then disabling access to the more technically inclined users now seems a bit silly.
I thought they’d at least wait for wider adoption before locking it down like they’re doing with YouTube and ad blockers, especially with imessage and WhatsApp being such big competitors. At least in Europe, I don’t see anyone dropping WhatsApp for RCS anytime soon.
The walled garden is something that grows fast everywhere. Users should have the rights over their devices. Maybe its time to get the EU on this train, their last approaches like the GDPR or the DSA are from near the same spirit.
Its unlikely that they’d get involved, RCS might be default on Googles messenger app but people still mainly use alternatives like WhatsApp so there’s not a big enough user base that would be affected and since Google is pushing RCS as interoperal, DSA won’t apply.
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Because it’s my device, not Googles.
Do you let Dell lock down your laptop and prevent you creating an Admin account?
Custom roms: I don’t want google service on my device.
As to rooting, I have rooted in the passed, its my device and I’m a tinkerer so why not?
Might as well ask why people run linux after buying a laptop with pre installed windows.
for me , privacy. no google services run in my phone, and none od my data gets shared with anyone
Because it’s my fucking phone.
Custom "rom"s extend the life of the device via both security updates and app compatibility. They’re usually able to be used without propriety Google shit at all, if the person wants.
Just rooting allows more control over what is and isn’t on the device, which goes back to the “my fucking phone” factor as well as the rest.
Yeah, you can partially debloat via adb, but that’s a partial solution to a systematic problem.
And that’s ignoring apps that can do more with root, if you want them to have those abilities.
Edit: hell, just access to hosts file is enough justification.
Speak for yourself.
I was speaking for myself, I have no idea why people do it. Didn’t say there aren’t legitimate reasons, I just don’t know any of them
I have installed custom ROM (PixelExperience) on my Moto G5s Plus. This way I extended its life by 2 years. The stock ROM only went up to Android 8.1 and was very slow and buggy, unlike with Android 7. This way I got Android 11 which was newest at the time. It was also much faster than the flawed 8.1 update.
Additionally, PixelExperience allowed some nice things. It looks like Google Pixel phone, even to Google, so I got free unlimited photo/video backups. This may be against ToS, but it’s not like I said I have a Pixel 5, they decided that I do ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Another really great thing is routing Wi-Fi hotspot over VPN. I definitely don’t want someone using my internet connection raw.Next, root. I have only done that with Samsung Galaxy Ace from 2011. No locked bootloader BS, just flash, Tada! Rooted.
This allowed me to do full backups, including apps on that device.But there’s countless other uses, most of which I forgot. Some that I can think of that would be useful to me are:
- Proper firewall
- Access to Android folder (without using desktop) (removed since Android 11)
- Full app backups
- Routing hotspot over VPN
- Band locking on Qualcomm SoC (possible without root on Exynos and MediaTek)
- WPS push and WPS pin Wi-Fi connection (insecure) (removed since Android 9)
- Opening ports <1024
- Changing screen resolution and aspect ratio (useful for screen mirroring)
- Removing bloatware
- Changing Wi-Fi MAC address manually
- Battery charge limiting (e.g. to 80%)
- Precise management of app permissions
Meh, they were speaking to the other population. They speak for most.
