Speed limits dont work, road design determines how fast people go.
A section of the A24 was limited to 130 kmph for 20 years to reduce accidents. Because the reduction the speed limit was lifted early this year. Now there are 8% more accidents with injury and 42% more injured. Politicians call now to make it possible to limit the section again.
For highway lowering the speed may be effective but lowering the speed limit from 50 to 30 won’t stop drivers from going 50 unless the road is designed for lower speeds. So long as lanes are wide and there are little obstructions for drivers to worry about hitting, such as bumpouts, boulevards, etc., they will go as fast as they feel comfortable unless there is a cop behind them.
Edit: 50kmh to 30kmh I don’t know what that is in freedom miles
BTW: the mortality is around 50% if a car hits a pedestrian at 50km/h.
At 30km/h it’s around 3%.
So yeah, speed in centre ville counts!
Damn pedestrians killing drivers for driving quickly, won’t somebody do something?!
In Germany the speed limit in Cities is 50km/h and in residential zones 30km/h, strong controlled with a lot of radar traps. If you exceed this they screw up your life, in case of hitting a pedestrian even possible with jail time. It cannot be confused by the lack of speed limit on some highway sections, that traffic regulations are very strict and controlled in Germany and any violation can be very expensive.
Or just do like we do in the US and place an “undercover” cop every quarter mile behind street signs.
it looks like it’s designed for pretty extreme speeds
Unlike the average driver.
It’s not actually. It’s quite an old network so it was built before cars could go as fast as they can go now. There are surprisingly sharp corners and very short off ramps. If it were built from scratch today it would be even safer. Speed limits are bs outside of particularly tricky areas.
Is the image from the article not of the highway in question?
Ah yep my bad, I was speaking generally. The image in the article is only a short section of highway but it does look like one of the 2 lane sections that are usually quite old. If they were more modern and built for higher speeds they’d have an even shallower curve and would probably be 3 lanes with a hard shoulder. If you drive on the Autobahn you’ll have a few moments where you notice the difference in road layout from those which more modern highways implement - the on and off ramps in particular can be a bit scary.
Speed limits absolutely do work if there are cameras and consequences. Unfortunately everyone seems to have decided that suspending licences and siezing cars is a human rights violation.
Speed limits do work, but the road should be designed with the speed limit in mind. Just slapping a new sign up and reducing the speed limit is going to lead to non-compliance - even if the speed limit is enforced by police.
The UK recently released figures on speed limit compliance. For 20mph roads (30-35kph) they primarily measured roads that didn’t have traffic calming measures recommended for 20mph roads (ie the roads don’t “feel” like 20mph roads), and they found 85% of drivers exceeded the speed limit.
High gasoline prices also influence the average speed on the highways. The vast majority of people do not usually go faster than 120, many even less.
Idk, I’m seeing plenty of people here for whom gasoline is evidently not expensive enough yet
That is the problem, people with high end cars have enough money to pay an expensive fuel. Apart with an industry which mostly expensive high end E-cars, the high fuel prices only affect the people wich don’t have money for such cars.
Well the funny part is that it’s not even people in high-end cars that I’m seeing
I was referring to those who go 300 on the highway, difficult for those with an old Ford Fiesta.
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The problem is that even in low traffic, there is a truck on the right lane every few meters. Often, after you switch to the right lane, someone decides to drive right next to you, forcing you to brake.
It’s just more comfortable to stay in the middle lane.Now IMHO the real problem is when trucks are overtaking with 101km/h…
It’s just more comfortable to stay in the middle lane.
It’s stil a dick move if the rightmost lane is free. Then you’re effectively overtaking a phantom car at the exact same velocity (as nobody is allowed to pass right).
I agree but need to have “free” defined. If there’s another truck 100/200m ahead then it’s a pain in the ass because like the other said, others behind you won’t do the same and will do a slight acceleration when you go in the right lane (because free space in front = accelerate hurr durr), preventing you from changing lanes again when you get to the next truck and so you have to brake and hope you get a gap again soon to overtake the truck.
If it’s literally empty as far as the eye can see then yeah, move over!
It’s like when a lane closes and people that merge in near the end get blocked for “trying to get ahead”. But the road is closed there, not a kilometre before. They closed it there to maximise multiple lanes as long as possible to limit the bottleneck caused by the lane closure—use it so everyone can get through quicker. It must be painful to see for the people that set it up. Whatever the situation, traffic go faster when maximising available space and lanes.
The rightmost lane is never completely free. And if it is, almost all drivers do use it.
What makes your right to go fast on the left lane more important than their right to go a reasonable ~120km/h in the middle lane?
What makes your right to go fast on the left lane more important than their right to go a reasonable ~120km/h in the middle lane?
Nothing, but that wasn’t the created scenario. If the right lane isn’t free, do stick in the middle lane of course (squishing two vehicles together isn’t gonna make them go faster, usually). The scenario created was talking of an empty right lane, which should only exist on the left side, as we should drive on the right side of the road.
10 seconds. If you’re not overtaking anything within 10 seconds, you should pull into the inside lane.
This is what I was taught in advanced driver training. However, in practice I use 7 seconds, because I find 10 seconds a little too far to easily estimate by eye. I end up thinking “is that 10 seconds? I’m not sure, maybe” then by the time I figure out it was more than 10 seconds it is now less than 7.
trucks are overtaking with 101km/h
As trucks are governed to a Vmax of 90 kph, and some even to 85 kph, I would suggest you get your speedometer checked, because it sounds like the advancement, required by law, is too high. It shouldn’t show more than 7% more than your actual speed. Truck speedos are more rigorously controlled and show an average of 2 kph too much at 80 kph, so trucks overtaking at 101 kph is not normally possible - of course, speedo manipulation does occur, but it isn’t so rampant that they all overtake at 101 kph.
Okay, I never looked at a truck’s speedometer. The point is they are overtaking just slightly faster.
It certainly feels like most trucks are going at least 90 km/h regularly.
The point is they are overtaking just slightly faster.
Trucks also spent long stretches in the same order, sometimes they change things up.
The speeds of trucks are measured on-board by a tachograph, so any big deviation can give them a fine, even if they weren’t caught on the spot.
And that 20 second delay really isn’t gonna impact the trip as a whole. Just rolling with it will make your trip less stressful, and therefore more enjoyable. If you’re late, rushing through traffic isn’t gonna make a significant impact, except on your risk of accidents.
And that 20 second delay really isn’t gonna impact the trip as a whole.
That is true. Therefore there shouldn’t be a problem with drivers driving a steady speed in the middle lane.
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It is totally okay, if they need to occupy the middle lane.
Truck drivers are running a commercial operation, I shouldn’t have to be inconvenienced so they can more easily make money - especially not when that inconvenience is caused by them not following the rules of the road.
Sometimes even the left lane.
This may be illegal, depending on jurisdiction and circumstances.
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It is about the person sitting inside the ferry. Once you work together with drivers you will change your attitude torwards them immediately. They working conditions are very difficult. Especially when they are crossing jurisdications/states.
This is the classic “feel sorry for the waiter working on sub-minimum wage, he’s supposed to be subsidised by tips!” bullshit argument. Yes, truck drivers are a victim of the businesses they work for and aren’t paid well enough. That doesn’t mean that they, as representatives of the business they work for, should get away with doing things that are wrong and inconvenience everyone else. Particularly when it is the business that sets the conditions that push drivers to behave as they do.
The truck driver might not be making much of a profit, for the long hours they work. But the truck is there to make a profit. The majority of everyone else on the road is not driving for work. People driving for work should not inhibit everyone else, who are inherently paying a loss to drive somewhere.
In fact, drivers in general shouldn’t inhibit others. Driving in the outside lane when you’re not overtaking is a shitty move, regardless.
Pay attention, plan well ahead to pull out when you need, accelerate as needed so you don’t hold up anyone when you pull out.
If you’re not willing or able to accelerate, then you shouldn’t pull out. By all means indicate your intention (and do so well in advance), but don’t move over until the lane is clear.
When I am driving I have no problems eith truck drivers. They even help going onto the highway or mention radars.
The people sitting in the middle are the problem.
Yeah, but we’re talking about truck drivers who sit in the middle lane.
It sounds like you’re from somewhere where this isn’t much of a problem. The professional drivers are professional. That’s awesome, but know that it doesn’t hold true everywhere, either across the US or in Europe or elsewhere. It’s not even a national thing, driving habits vary by region.
But yeah, people sitting in the middle is a problem. The bigger problem is that it’s so poorly defined - I was taught “if you’re not overtaking within 10 seconds, you should pull over”. 10 seconds is very conservative, I work to 7 seconds.
Most people somehow decided that its easiest to drive in the middle lane at slow(ish) speeds, while the right lane stays empty for long stretches.
Really? In my experience driving on German roads (primarily down near Munich), lane discipline is exceptionally good. The only times I saw significantly lower driving standards was in rush hour.
Meanwhile, the UK is notorious for people sitting in the middle lane. That used to be the rule, the inside lane was the slow lane, middle for cruising and outside for overtaking, however that was changed in the 60s/70s. It’s recently been made formally illegal, rather than just contrary to the highway code, but even trained police drivers are still guilty of doing it.
In the Netherlands they’re very big on pulling back in. So much so they frequently cut your nose off by pulling in so early.
It’s fun seeing how driving styles vary between different regions and countries.
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Driving on occassion on the A8 near Stuttgart and can’t confirm it.
Usually trucks are clogging the most right line and overtaking each on the 2nd lane.
Most PKWs drive on the 2nd/3rd lane while the racers and overtakers use the 3rd/4th lane.
Also who cares about overtaking from the right. If you drive 120kph and my lane all drive 130 kph I will naturally overtake you. No need to switch lanes if the lane is free. Just don’t overtake at +30 kph but more at 10 kph in relation to base Autobahn speed.Pkw - Panzerkampfwagen?
PersonenKraftWagen
PersonalPowerVehicle
PersonalCar
CarIt’s a reference to this: https://reddit.com/r/de/s/rN0qIhSanO
I actually didn’t even know this existed prior to this comment, just saw the funny acronym (: thanks for that hilarious
Neat post
Thanks for the lore
I prefer tanki (;
Stupid Leopards keep clogging up the highways
Just don’t overtake at +30 kph but more at 10 kph
The law does account for this: If all lanes are well populated and you find your lane is actually moving faster than the lane to your left, you may pass - not overtake - on the right, as long as you are not more than 20 kph faster than the left lane.
The difference is in passing and overtaking: Passing is merely going faster than the other lane, but staying in your lane afterwards. Overtaking, or to give it its correct name of undertaking, is passing and then changing into the same lane as the passed vehicle.
Yeah, that’s what I meant.
Thanks for clarifying!
Yeah trucks across Europe are generally pretty good, primarily because in many countries it’s illegal for them to be in the 3rd lane (except sometimes in heavy slow moving traffic).
Overtaking from the right, or undertaking, is often illegal also, though. So while I agree that it should be ok, strictly speaking it isn’t.
What is legal is to overtake on the outside, move into their lane, then the inside lane, then slow down so they overtake you. Rinse and repeat, count how many donuts you can draw around them before they move over.
Speaking as an American here… could we NOT park cars in the left lane. I’ve seen enough habits of drivers in other countries where the left lane is exclusively for passing, it’s so simple and superior for traffic but Americans be dumb selfish shits behind the wheel.
Left is for passing. You may not overtake in right lane. At least that’s how it works in Sweden. Thus if left lane is slow, right is slower.
I like this in concept. The issue is that we often get asshats who want to go slow in the left lane.
When my options are to go 5 under the speed limit, or pass on the right, I’m passing on the right every time.
You don’t understand, I have to turn left in 25 km and what if I can’t get back into my lane after I let you pass and I miss my turn. I’m not a confident driver so I am going to do what’s safest and best for me and everyone else can just accept it. I’m going fast enough at 5km over the posted speed limit and you can just slow down, life isn’t a race unless I need it to be.
-The asshole I encounter daily on my commute.
turn left WHERE. ON A HIGHWAY?? WAAAAAAAAAAAA
My highway has lights because the gov’t was too cheap for clovers in the 90s.
In the US, generally you cannot pass in the right lane except when the left lane refuses to move over despite having ample room
In the US it varies depending on which state you’re in and which way the wind is blowing up the cop’s asshole.
Does this apply inside the city aswell? In Germany, this only applys outside the city…
In Sweden passing on the right is only permitted in two main scenarios.
Rate of speed lower than 70kph, or the lanes go to different destinations.
Where i live it’s fucking madness. People change lanes randomly, sit in the far left going 10 under the limit, pass on the right or left at seeming random, and sometimes just drive in the middle lane doing 30 mph in a 70 mph zone with their fucking hazards on. Don’t even get me started on their merge technique, jealousy and resentment are what rule people’s decisions and nobody has ever even heard of zipper merging. It’s a shock there aren’t more accidents than there are.
I once watched someone sitting in the far left at the limit, come up against someone driving on the left going 10 under, decide to undertake, and then slow down to like 30 under to “punish” the person.
I’ve changed lanes to pass only to have people change in front of me to block me, then change back when i changed back.
But most of all, and it should be noted i drive a two seater sports car here, i’ve had people in their huge ass SUVs look over at me, MAKE EYE CONTACT with me, and then merge into whatever lane i was in at the time like they were trying to drive me off the road.
Fuck!
I’ve actually been pulled over for being in the left lane too long in the US, so it does happen, but not enough.
Did you get a ticket?
I think the real trouble is that it’s hard to convict on that. It’s not like speeding, where you either are or you aren’t, it’s much harder to establish that you shouldn’t be in the outside lane. I mean, it seems pretty clear in most cases, but the lack of a clearly defined boundary makes it very difficult in law. This ends up making it feel like a waste of time to law enforcement, both police and courts, because they could be doing things that will be more likely to have the intended outcome.
It’s really annoying though, because advanced driver courses sometimes do define it: 10 seconds.
If you’re not overtaking within 10 seconds, you should move over. Personally, I find it easier to estimate a 7 second distance by eye - 10 seconds is quite conservative.
It might be a density thing. I often notice that the left lane being full in dense city populations. Get a tad outside and it’s back to normal.
I’ve been fined on German highways for going too fast. Memes like these are myths. It is based on fact that there is no default upper limit on highway. But there are speed-limit signs on German highways.
I think it’s based on the (fahrt fahrt fahrt auf den) Autobahn. Now, I’m not german so I could be wrong, but here’s what wikipedia says regarding speed limits on the autobahn:
Much of the system has no speed limit for some classes of vehicles.[1] However, limits are posted and enforced in areas that are urbanised, substandard, accident-prone, or under construction. On speed-unrestricted stretches, an advisory speed limit (Richtgeschwindigkeit) of 130 kilometres per hour (81 mph) applies.[2] While driving faster is not illegal in the absence of a speed limit, it can cause an increased liability in the case of a collision (which mandatory auto insurance has to cover); courts have ruled that an “ideal driver” who is exempt from absolute liability for “inevitable” tort under the law would not exceed Richtgeschwindigkeit.
So, it certainly seems there is a basis for the jokes, even if they aren’t 100% historically accurate.
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If there are people in the middle lane and you blast past them at double their speed, that could be seen as unsafe
First comes the Porsche, who then gets bullied off the left lane by a Lamborghini, who then gets bullied off the left lane by an Audi RS6.
That’s Germany
You forgot about the Ford Focus bullying the Audi off of the left lane.
“Was is’n des für ein Kombi? Der macht ja voll Terror!”
Legendary video
You can totally go 250km/h on the A5 from Frankfurt to Darmstadt, if traffic allows it. That wont always be possible, but typically if it isnt during work traffic, 160-200km/h is doable comfortably, even on other parts of the Autobahn
The longest unrestricted part that ive driven should be the A71, where you can go longer passages without restrictions, save for the tunnels.
You’re forgetting that my car doesn’t go faster than 150km/h, and even at that speed the battery lasts way shorter than at a comfortable 120km/h🤡
Fuel consumption at 200km/h is almost double compared to 120km/h, so who has the cash anyway. And even if you do, is it worth it? Nah.
An Autobahn has per default no speed limit for cars, except when there is one indicated by a speed limit sign. But there are many parts on any Autobahn without speed limit signs, so in reality you can very often drive as fast as you want.
There are many opportunities to drive with 200km/h or more if you want, but often the traffic prevents going with this speed for longer than a few seconds or minutes.
Plus, anyone who has traveled in South Asia or South America knows that Germany is much, much more safe to drive in than most of the rest of the world.
Hey, we have strikt rules on a highway! For example if you’re driving slower than everybody else and your IQ is under 70 you are prohibited to drive on the right lane even if it’s empty.
Laughing in german…
On the other side, Germany has TÜV with a mandatory vehicle inspection every 2 years with some exceptions for new cars.
They check vital components for road safety and won’t allow the car to be on public roads when it’s not fixed within a month. And it’s not like your tires have no rest profile anymore, it’s like you have to change them when they’re at 1,6mm… recommended is to change at 4mms…
Some “Prüfer” are chill but sometimes you won’t pass because your winter tires you were drivimg for 5 years, are 0,3% bigger than the allowed ones in the registrationpapers… at least I heard.
we have this every year in slovenia. you have to pass a technical inspection then register your car
my mom’s car failed bexause her handbrake was 11% less efficient than new (limit being 10%). she had to get it replaced and then the car passed perfectly with 0 issues stated
i’d rather do this shit than have some jerk driving around with a car thats about to fall apart and maybe not have a working brake
MOT every year in the UK, similar stuff
I know, but sorry we’re miles apart from each other. I’ve seen “street legal” cars in UK which will get you in jail in Germany xD Tbh I don’t mind those restrictions but some are way over the top here
Doesn’t Germany also enforce vehicle separation so people aren’t driving too close to each other on highways? That and passing on the left.
Yeees. But some of the guidelines are confusing. So the basic rule is that you have to keep a “2-second distance”. This is the distance you vehicle would travel in two second without breaking. The Formular is 2x(v²/100). But at lower speeds its a completely different calculation. And when you are waaay faster you are supposed to leave half your speed in metres as a gap. Then there are separate rules for fog and long vehicles and multiple vehicles that drive in a row on one lane roads and all that.
There are also rules for the distance you should keep to the cars and especially bikes next to you and they are different depending on if you are in a “place” or outside of one :)
Is that not a thing in most countries? Tailgating cant be legal in most countries, right?
We don’t have enough signs to make a speed limit happen - Volker Wissing, German minster of transit (Sadly not a joke: source)
Then, uh, get more?
Or just say: limit is 130 km/h and remove every sign saying 130 and higher. But that would all be too easy.
Was gonna say, before the Dutch did that stunt with time dependent speed limits the ‘unlimited’ sign just meant 130kph. At the border would be a sign explaining this and that’s that.
The FDP target group are above average people that enjoy fast expensive cars and that’s exactly what there politics are about. They are pretty much the only party pushing Porsches e-fuels in whole europe and keeping all incentives for the car lobby up and running.
That’s the dumbest excuse I’ve ever heard.
if there are speed limits i usually am forced to spend more time dicking around looking for signs or cops or checking the speedometer, instead of focusing on the road and how safe my current speed actually feels
If your mental capacity is reached by checking your surroundings while all the traffic is going roughly the same speed as you, then no way youre capable of handling “no speed limit” where everyone is driving to their liking.
It’s not just you who’d be suddenly free to do whatever they want, but everyone else too.
Claiming “I know better what’s best for me” is the best sign of someone who absolutely doesn’t.
I think you’re misunderstanding their message. To me it reads that places where there’s low speed limits, are also places where you need to pay a lot of attention on the street and surroundings and wouldn’t want to drive faster anyways
Fair, maybe that’s how it was meant. But “dicking around” makes me think otherwise.
I think traffic calming is really interesting for this reason, building roads to make you feel most comfortable at the correct speed. The road design here is usually good, but when driving I feel really anxious on roads that have a design not matching the speed limit too.
100% agreed. If I don’t set cruise control, I usually speed on my commute due to me just focusing on the grip of my car, distance to/from other cars, and perceived speed. It’s just hard to gauge speed without checking often on my speedometer, which isn’t as safe. Even just trying to follow at a constant distance in the right lane is difficult because the semi trucks usually end up having wide speed differences at random times, meaning 60mph-80mph depending on the hill usually.
This can be solved quite easily by introducing head-up-displays in cars showing the speed in front of the driver. HUDs were introduced years ago in some airliners allowing the pilots to maintain situational awareness while having quick access to the critical information about the aircraft. And introducing safety standards from commercial aviation is almost always a good step.
I’ve driven a car that kind of projected your speed onto the bottom of the wind shield. It’s really convenient, can recommend.
Don’t go faster than the speed of light (optional).
German here. We do have speed limits on highways. The portions without are often not that long so you rarely get a chance to go truly wild.
Regardless, the highest I usually go is like 180kmh and that doesn’t happen very often.
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Okay yes of course. I live in the south west. my primary autobahn is the A1 and holy fuck it’s always just a cluster fuck of Baustellen
But you miss the point: BAB doesn’t mean BundesAutoBahn, it means Baustelle Am Baustelle.
The roadworks all over nowadays is due to years of neglect in the 80s and 90s.
True
Fun fact: Germany is about average when it comes to road safety in Europe, which is still impressing since we’ve got the highest traffic density.
Vietnamese: Traffic Safety? What’s that?
Could be worse though
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate
Biggest laugh I had in a long time I am crying omg
You’re welcome.
optional
😆
Yes omg that killed me
I want to know more about the top picture, anyone know the source?
There have been multiple cases tracking of lone wolves teaming up with bears for short periods to hunt.
Crazy, I would be interested in reading about that.
Origin
On February 12th, 2023, Redditor thereveldune4 posted an image to /r/blursedimages that showed a bear and a wolf staring at each other, using a Kubrick Stare POV of both. The top photo was captured by Peter A. Dettling. The post received more than 36,800 upvotes in five months (shown below).Spread The post gained iterations after viral reposts surfaced on Instagram months later. For instance, on June 15th, 2023, Instagram user @huge.poop uploaded the photo, receiving more than 45,000 likes in one month. Then, the image grew popular as an object labeling template. For example, on July 13th, 2023, TikTok user @suj7683 uploaded a photo slideshow of the image comparing requirements of Formula 1 in 2007 and 2023. The post received more than 1 million views in one week (shown below, left). On July 15th, 2023, TikTok[4] user @formula_1_freak uploaded a similar slideshow, comparing Formula 1 and Isle of Man TT. The post received more than 1.8 million views in five days (shown below, right).
After checking that out it’s not the original, that’s the origin of the template.
But now you know where you have to search.
Eh, I DEFINITELY don’t care about this enough to make a Reddit account, wait two weeks so I can send a private message, wait an indeterminate amount of time for the guy who posted it to find my message and MAYBE reply (assuming his account isn’t banned, which is unlikely since this is Reddit), or post hundreds of spam comments to get enough karma to meet whatever that sub calls their karma requirements. If no one has the source I guess I’ll just never know.
The original image of a bear and wolf facing off against each other comes from an image originally taken and published by Canadian wildlife photographer Peter Dettling. Dettling even managed to capture the bear and wolf looking around as if to check if anyone had seen them lock eyes. Same source…
That wolf’s nose has too many fingers.
“Rest of world” Lol. India, Brazil, parts of Italy… the rule is do whatever you want, try not to crash, bigger vehicle has the right of way.
Brazil is far from lawless. In really small communities 12-year-Olds are driving scooters without wearing helmets, sure, but in all Metropolitan areas laws are pretty strict and there are expensive fines.
Tbf you can’t go over like 50 in most Indian roads anyway.
