seems like the ‘safe’ public opinion is ‘we stand behind israel’ and the left opinion is palestinian support
i don’t live there i don’t have any particular interest or fascination with the region i don’t understand any of this pls don’t yell at me
It’s pretty easy to explain: It’s complicated.
Basically, it’s a conflict that had been running for a really long time.
Before WW1, the area of Israel/Palestine was inhabited by Arabs and controlled by the Ottomans.
During WW1, the Brits promised the Arabs that they’d back an independent arab state there, if the Arabs revolted and successfully kicked out the Ottomans.
The Arabs did their part, so Britain, being as trustworthy as ever, turned around and divvied the Ottoman empire up between them, and Britain got control over what was then called Mandatory Palestine, which the Arabs saw as a betrayal. The official plan was for the Brits to rule the Mandate “until such time as they are able to stand alone”.
At the same time, the Zionist Jews wanted to have a national state, where they could live without persecution, and many European nations, where antisemitism was rampant, wanted them gone from Europe, so they kinda had an agreement there. The original plan was to move them to a part of Uganda, but that fell through so Palestine was chosen.
Already long before the national state was created, lots of Jews moved there and created settlements. The Arabs there weren’t exactly happy about that massive influx of settlers and the Jews also weren’t happy about the natives. Each of them started an uprising over the following years, and with tensions rising, the UN drafted a partition plan.
While the opinion of the Jews over that partition plan was ambivalent, though leaning towards being happy about it, the Arabs were decidedly unhappy about it. They thought, that the UN was overstepping it’s rights and that the partition plan was violating the principles of self-determinism set forth by the UN charter.
So a war broke out between the Arabs (including surrounding arab countries) and the Jews there, which resulted in a victory for the Jews. After that, the area was divided up between Jewish Israel, the west bank area controlled by Jordan and inhabited by Arabs, and the tiny area called Gaza strip, controlled by Egypt and inhabited by Palestinians.
The area the Palestinians received after the war was significantly smaller than what was outlined in the UN partition plan.
In 1967, during the six-day war, Israel captured the Gaza strip and it’s been under Israeli occupation ever since. In 1993, Israel granted the Gaza strip limited self-government over the area. Basically, Gaza was allowed to self-government about matters of the populated areas, but Israel remained in control in regards to the airspace, the territorial waters and all border crossings except the one towards Egypt, which is controlled by Egypt.
In 2007, Hamas took over the government of Gaza. Most of the world classify them as a terror organisation, and they have been e.g. shooting home-build missiles into Israel and also have mounted a few small-scale insurrections and attacks against Israel.
Israel on the other hand has been casually bombarding and killing Palestinians for a very long time. Also, they let Israeli settlers illegally settle in occupied Palestinian territories, which the Palestinians are not so happy about.
From 2008 until 2020, roughly 5600 Palestinians and 250 Israelis (including many civilians on both sides) have been killed, and 115 000 Pakistanis and 5600 Israelis have been injured (source: https://www.statista.com/chart/amp/16516/israeli-palestinian-casualties-by-in-gaza-and-the-west-bank/).
The Gaza strip is pretty much an outdoor prison, with a massive population density, low life expectency and abysmal living standards. People are generally not allowed to leave from there. Israel routinely cuts water/electricity, which are both supplied by Israel in response to attacks from Palestine.
All in all, it’s a right mess that’s been brewing for over 100 years, with no easy solutions. By now, everyone who has been responsible for causing the original mess is dead. Of the leadership neither side is in the right, both sides are making everything worse. There is no solution in sight.
The Palestinians fight the oppression by killing civilians, the Israelis counter by killing civilians and making life even more hell for the people in the occupied territories, who in turn fight even harder and kill more civilians.
Reducing oppression is hardly possible, since that would allow the Palestinians to mount bigger attacks.
Which brings us to the current situation. Palestinians managed to break out of Gaza, at many places even destroying the perimeter fence. They then invaded some towns and a music festival in the border regions, killing a few hundred Israeli civilians and taking some more hostage. Israel countered by bombarding the Gaza strip, killing a few hundred Palestinian civilians. They also, again, cut power and electricity, and the whole western world then responded with cutting food supply.
This in turn will radicalize the Palestinians even more, who will fight harder, and who knows where it ends. Probably with the Israelis finally finding the same answer to “the Palestinian Question” that Germany found for the “Jewish Question” in the 1940s.
Really nice summary. Heads up you say Pakistani instead of Palestinian a few times.
Never knew about the Uganda thing. Fascinating. Must read more on that.
Thanks, sorry about that. I meant Palestinian.
Another indigenous population beginning with P who got fucked over by brits who had never been to the area. Easy mistake to make.
I mean, I do know the difference between Pakistani and Palestinians. It’s just that I know significantly more Pakistanis than Palestinians, so my brain autocompleted wrong.
Sorry to all Palestinians/Pakistanis I might have offended here!
Reducing oppression is hardly possible, since that would allow the Palestinians to mount bigger attacks.
I feel like there are many things Israel does that are not useful in stopping attacks and ending them should be possible. Intentionally killing civilians and destroying civilian infrastructure are among those.
It’s totally true that killing civilians means you radicalize all their family and friends.
In 2006, the newly elected Hamas government actually stepped down during a negotiated cease fire and agreed to a unity government.
Then the Israelis accidentally (at least according to their statements) bombed a residential building, killing 24 civilians including children and injuring many more.
That’s when the Hamas took back the government (some would point out, illegally, since there was no official election after they stepped down) and resumed the attacks on Israel.
But all in all, it’s a prisoner’s dilemma situation. The current situation sucks, but for both sides it would probably be worse, at least in short-term, to unilaterally reduce aggressions without the other side doing the same.
Understandably (after all this bloodshed over such a long period), there are quite a few people on both sides who will stop at nothing short but the eradication of the other side. That’s not exactly a viable basis for negotiations.
And with every attack, every uprising, every repression and every civilian killed, this gets worse.
for both sides it would probably be worse, at least in short-term, to unilaterally reduce aggressions without the other side doing the same.
I don’t see how, as far as attacking non-military targets goes.
Hamas intentionally uses civilian buildings and schools as ammo warehouses. Israel aims for the ammunition and ignores the civilian casualties. Neither side wants to avoid civilian deaths in Gaza.
How long do you have? Here’s the very brief summary, and full disclaimer, I don’t have dog in this race.
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Jerusalem is an important place for both Jews and Muslims.
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They’ve been fighting over this space for two millenia. The Roman’s had it for a long time (Christian), the Ottomans had it for a long time (Islamic).
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After WW1 and the Ottomans were defeated, it passed onto the Turkish (Islamic).
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After WW2, with Britain now in control of Palestine and with the surviving Jews now displaced worldwide with no country to live, the U.N decided to give Jews a new home and call this new place the State of Israel. They put Israel right in the middle of Palestine, which no Islamic nation could object to because they were all defeated in war.
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Since then, Jews call Israel their home country. Surrounding Islamic countries don’t recognise Israel and want the Jews to leave.
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Islamic nations including Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, Iran, Syria have all gone to war with Israel (the 6-day War) to kick the Jews out. They’ve all lost because Israel is militarily backed by world powers. Israel is now a military powerhouse and have full control of the region.
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Israel allow Muslim Palestinians small areas to live in the area, namely Gaza and the West Bank, but they’re not particularity nice to the Muslims living there. This is the Palestinian/Israeli war that’s been going on for almost a century.
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This space is now two main religions crammed into a very small space. Both claim that it’s their ancestral land. Islamic nations don’t recognise Israel as a country. Most of the rest of the world does.
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Israel has become a defensive fortress with nukes, and is surrounded by five countries that hate it. No Islamic nation is strong enough to beat Israel. Skirmishes and shit fighting continues. Sometimes it gets serious. This week it got really serious.
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This fight will probably go on forever because of the religious significance of Jerusalem which neither the Israelis or Palestinians will ever give up claim to.
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So who’s right and who’s wrong? Probably neither. Probably both. Probably humans are just shit.
EDIT: I know there’s lots of missing parts here but honestly, the full story would be a semester of university worth of info. I tried to keep this ultra-digestible, without bias or conspiracy or finger pointing.
Thank you below for the corrections.
The only thing I’d add is “not particularity nice to the Muslims living there” is putting it mildly.
Because there’s always tension, Israel takes its security very seriously. Unlike most countries, who put a token effort into security most of the time, Israel really is an armed fortress. That makes it very easy for someone with an itchy trigger finger to shoot someone who didnt deserve shooting. Even with the best will in the world, it would happen from time to time.
That, of course, makes the Palestinians very angry. An angry population poses more of a threat, and is more likely to do something genuinely aggressive. The Israeli security is thus tightened further, and their soldiers get even itchier trigger fingers and around and around we go.
It doesn’t take long before everyone involved has a personal grudge for one reason or another, and things can get really vicious.
- After WW1 and the Ottomans were defeated, it passed onto the Turkish (Islamic).
- After WW2 the Turkish were defeated and they lost it to Britain. In the same war the surviving Jews were displaced worldwide and had no country to live, so the League of Nations (U.S, Britain, Canada, France mainly) decided to give Jews a new home and call this new place the State of Israel. They put Israel right in the middle of the British controlled Palestine, which no Islamic nation could object to because they were all defeated in war.
Turkey never fought in ww2. Turkey was already after ww1 completely stripped of territory in the Levant. There also was no league of nations after ww2 anymore, but the UN was founded. No Arabic nations were defeated in ww2. Some of 4. happened after ww1 not 2. The creation of Israel was heavily objected by the neighboring Arabic nations, see 6-Day-War.
Ahh, fair. I got some WW1 and WW2 details mixed up. I’ll edit so I’m not feeding false info.
They’ve been fighting over this space for two millenia.
It’s been on and off and off and off and off and off and off and off and off and on again.
It’s kinda like if the Italians showed up en masse in England, claiming that they have a right to the place, because the romans once held that area.
The Jews weren’t the first people in Israel either, not even in biblical times.
Very comprehensive write up, but i think something a lot of answers miss out on is…well, who was there before the romans? The romans called the area Judaea…land of the Jews. Before the Romans the Seleucid Empire had to deal with several uprisings led by…the Jews (the maccabean revolt). Its not enirely accurate id say to say the jews just materialised in the region in the 1950s…
The romans called the area Judaea…land of the Jews.
Just a quick correction here. Judaea is actually named after Judah, son of Jacob.
The word ‘Jew’ comes from the place name Judaea, not the other way around.
Ooh i didnt know that TIL
Thank you for recognizing that this stuff is not going on for a century or two, not even for centuries, but for millenia. The conflicts in the mesopotamian area are probably the oldest in the world. Reducing it to what happened after or shortly before WWII is like telling the history of the world/the universe starting from when homo sapiens came into place.
Trying to figure out who this land belongs to seems futile. How many great grandfather generations do you have to go back to make this part of soil “yours”? Is 10 enough? 15? 20? Imagine your family lived in this part of the region since 1000 AD just for someone to come and say they’ve been here since 900 AD so you are technically a foreign invader and don’t belong there. Give back your house.
I sometimes wonder if they go back further than the religions the conflict is supposedly based on. I mean, tribal conflicts have always been a thing, right?
There’s a lot right and a lot wrong in this
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US and UK politicians have large Israel supporting populations (whether Christian evangelists, hard right nationalists (“i-rony”) or just old fashioned Zionist Jews) so they have to kiss the ring and support Israel.
Germany has a forever guilt for the Holocaust so they support Israel.
India is run by Hindu nationalists who have a psychopathic hatred of Muslims so they also support Israel.
Anyone else who has any decency or inner feeling of justice will support Palestinians for being subject to decades of occupation and apartheid and know that it’s utterly hypocritical to support Ukraine for resisting Russian aggression while condemning Palestinians for doing the same.
Anyone who has any decency or feeling of inner justice will support innocent civilians regardless of their country of origin, and will condemn terrorist acts and war crimes regardless of who commited them.
True, but what often goes unreported is the massive scale at which Israel is killing Palestinians.
Check out this link for example: https://www.statista.com/chart/amp/16516/israeli-palestinian-casualties-by-in-gaza-and-the-west-bank/
Israel kills and injures roughly 20 Palestinians for each Israeli killed/injured by Palestine.
The current era of the conflict started in 2006, when the Hamas during a ceasefire stepped down from the government in favour of a less radical government to lead to a peace process. But then Israel bombed a residential building (they say by accident), killing 24 civilians including children and injuring many more.
That’s when the Hamas took back the power and restarted their attacks on Israel.
No argument there.
funny how they suddenly care about them while Palestinian civilians have brutally mistreated for decades.
this is like the teacher freaking out when the bullied kid finally fights back
Anyone else who has any decency or inner feeling of justice will support Palestinians for being subject to decades of occupation and apartheid and know that it’s utterly hypocritical to support Ukraine for resisting Russian aggression while condemning Palestinians for doing the same.
This would sound a lot better if Hamas was not targeting civilians, which is not at all what the Ukrainian military is doing. Comparing these two is an insult to Ukraine.
The safe position is, Israel did bad things but Hamas is bad for wanting to commit genocide/attacking random festival. I think.
I said this in another thread and I will say it again here:
I always find it odd how people blame “extremists” and the Palestinians for this.
Israel starts to steal homes, land and killing men, children and women. No one bat an eye to that.
Then extremists and hate towards Israel came and bam, they are the bad ones suddenly.
Certainly what Hamas does is entirely wrong however - People cannot expect them be silent and get killed by Israeli forces.
This is what happens from decades upon decades of oppression.
This entire conflict was created by Israel stealing land and starting a genocide mission on Palestinians.
I am pretty sure the entire conflict started because arabs deny the right of Israel to exist tho
Nope.
Before WW1 the area was inhabited by Arabs and controlled by the Ottomans.
During WW1, the Brits promised the Arabs an independent state of Palestine, if they revolt against the Ottomans and kick them out, which they did.
The Brits, being Brits, did what Brits do and kept control over that area, now called Mandatory Palestine, and wanted to keep controlling that area “until such time as they are able to stand alone”.
So this area was very much promised to the people who lived there for centuries.
At the same time, Zionist Jews wanted their own national state, and antisemites in Europe wanted the same, as long as that meant that the Jews where far away from Europe. So this unlikely alliance between Jews and Antisemites first looked at moving the Jews to Uganda, which was also controlled by the Brits. That plan fell through, and instead they promised them modern-day Israel. Of course without asking the natives who they promised the area too.
So lots of Jews moved there, which the natives didn’t like. Both sides mounted a bigger insurrection, until the UN, again without asking the natives, decided to split up the area between Jews and Palestinians.
The local arab population, aided by Jordan and Egypt, started a war, that Israel won. Israel then annexed a lot of land, that, according to the UN plan was promised to the Palestinians and since then they occupied the areas and ruled with an iron fist there. For each Israeli killed, they kill 20 Palestinians. Palestinians are not allowed to leave the area and Israel randomly turns off water, electricity and food supplies, whenever they feel like it.
Claiming “it’s just because Arabs don’t like Israel” is pretty one-sided.
What happened there is pretty much every right-extremist-conspiracy-theorist’s fever nightmare. A huge amount of foreign settlers immigrating, taking away land and supressing the local population. But instead of this being conspiracy nonsense that right-wing extremists spew to cause fear, it really happened there. And it was even much worse than the right-wing fear phantasies.
I agree with almost everything you said, except the first paragraph. Jews were living in that area for thousands of years, it’s not like they been dropped to a completely new territory.
So they did have historic ties with that land
Yes, there was a tiny minority of Jews in the area during Ottoman rule. But it was fewer people than Christians there. And almost all of the Jews that moved there to found Israel had no connection to the land at all.
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That’s okay! Wishing is a good thing. However I’m glad blocking exists on Lemmy.
EDIT: Would like to add on this, that it is kind of sad and unfortunate that you do not have a counter argument or even at least a valid one and thus you have to resort to such a thing.
Israel starts to steal homes, land and killing men, children and women.
Can I get a source for this? I’ve been living under a rock.
Israel killing children in 2022: https://www.savethechildren.net/news/2022-becomes-deadliest-year-palestinian-children-west-bank-over-15-years-save-children Israel taken over houses: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/5/4/if-i-dont-steal-your-home-someone-else-will-jewish-settler-says
There was a few years ago before Pandemic about a Palestinian guy getting arrested for talking to an journalist regards his house been taken over by Israeli people. I will try to find that one as well. It was big on the news (at least in my country back then).
Thanks for the input. I haven’t been following this story closely.
why were they having a music festival next to a concentration camp?
No idea, but what I do know is that it’s not a justification for murdering them.
They attacked and defeated a huge number of military targets as well, which has been heavily downplayed in the Western News media I’ve seen.
Israel is bad for committing genocide.
Palestinians are apparently bad for not wanting to be genocided.
Close.
Israel was and is bad for committing genocide.
Hamas is bad for doing a terrorism
Palestinians are apparently bad because the government the majority of them didn’t vote for is bad.
The true victims of this war, as always, are the civilians
Hamas is a bad palestinian group.
But palastine minus hamas really holds no fault. Israel is the antagonist between the two nations.
Hamas just just a terrorist response to that. And while terrorism is always bad, israel did actively cultivate that terror group.
Huh, interesting take. I guess Israel minus the settler hardliners is as unfaulty.
Palestinians have a UN recognized right to armed struggle. How do you recommend they carry that out?
Do you mean palestinians in general? Or do you specifically mean hamas?
Cause the answer is different depending.
How do you recommend that Palestinians engage in armed struggle?
Probably by fighting actual soldiers, not bombing civilians and kidnapping children.
Do you recognize the bombing of Hiroshima as a war crime?
So, specifically palestinians in general?
I think based on what little I know of the region and the style of invasion, guerrilla tactics would likely be ideal. Finding some sort of ally on the global stage to help them argue their case against israels abundant political backing. Make the occupation as inconvenient for israels government as possible, while doing everything they can to shift the global publics opinion into sympathy for their fight.
think based on what little I know of the region and the style of invasion, guerrilla tactics would likely be ideal.
The current engagement is largely guerilla tactics against military installations.
Finding some sort of ally on the global stage to help them argue their case against israels abundant political backing. Make the occupation as inconvenient for israels government as possible, while doing everything they can to shift the global publics opinion into sympathy for their fight.
This is not armed struggle. The Palestinians have a right to armed struggle.
Without raping and murdering civilians, to start? Fuck Israel, but that doesn’t make Hamas the good guys.
Is there a war that you think was fought justly?
Ill give you my two cents:
Palestinians are justified in fighting Israel until that occupation is no longer considered a country, however, the Hamas are committing atrocities against civilians, leading many to refer to them as terrorists. The argument for the Hamas (not all Palestinians) is that Israel has committed atrocities against Palestinians for almost a century, while being backed by the most powerful countries in the world, and that retaliation from the Hamas is justified.
Personally, I’m happy to see anyone resisting Israel, and don’t believe any political compromise (although preferable) will cut it except the dissolution of Israel.
Best summary I’ve seen so far. I hope one day that Palestinians will be free from living under a fascist government. I just don’t think the terrorist local government is the right vessel for change. Call me naive, but I miss PLO.
The zionists played a part in the accendancy of Hamas over the PLO:
https://theintercept.com/2018/02/19/hamas-israel-palestine-conflict/
Communists from the PLFP are active in the current struggle as the “Abu Ali Mustafa Brigades”.
It’s not a good idea to lump the left into “Palestinian support”. Some people on the left are still pro Israel, although probably a result of western propaganda. Those that are not pro Israel, all recognize that Israel is bad. The level of bad ranges from as little as kills women and children all the way to genocide. Some people take it as far as being anti Jew, which sucks because all of the Jews that wouldn’t live in Israel/support the oppression of those that were there first don’t live in Israel. The problem isn’t Jews, it’s western imperialism and Israel.
My take is, Israel was created 75 years ago by the US and UK as a way for the west to maintain control in the middle east when their previous efforts failed. Israel has never respected their borders, has constantly been expanding by brutal force, holds the Gaza strip hostage, and doesn’t allow Palestinians within their borders to leave or get citizenship. (I don’t recall the number of Palestinians within the border but 200,000 is sticking in my head?)
Israel’s “right” to the land is imposed by the west after WWII, and the reality is it was the home of Palestinians.
Now, on the other side of things, Hamas has expressed the desire to eradicate Jews from the earth multiple times. If they had the backing of the west the situation would be reversed, potentially worse. But I would argue Hamas wouldn’t be in power if Israel wasn’t formed 75 years ago. When millions of people are oppressed and murdered on the regular for 75 years, that’s a recipe for radicalization.
Oh, and I didn’t even get to the religious part. Islam is an abrahamic religion, a descendant of Judaism, although they don’t seem to like to talk about that. Jerusalem is the holy land of the Jews, and therefore it’s also the holy land of Islam (and technically Christians too, although I don’t think any of them care anywhere near as much). Both the Jews in Israel and the Palestinians believe they are gods chosen people of that land. I would say most Jews today don’t feel the need to own that land, but most Jews in Israel do. Trump moved the capital of Israel to Jerusalem which was a dick move, because it was technically still shared territory at that point. But anyway, radical religious conservatives become terrorists when given the right environment.
My final take, Israel and Hamas are both terrorist organizations who desire eradication of the other ethnicity, but Israel has the backing, propaganda, and sympathy of the West.
BTW the Gaza strip holds 2 million palestinians, not just 200k.
I was referring to those within Israel’s borders when I said 200k, but the clarification matters so thanks!
He moved the US embassy, not Israel’s capital. I’m sure he would have loved that much direct power over a nation-state, though. Also yeah, a dick move.
Recognized != Moved
I guess that’s debatable. Given that Israel itself came into existence when the US and UK recognized it as a state, I consider recognizing Jerusalem as the capital the same thing as moving it from Tel Aviv, but maybe that’s misleading because it ignores nuance.
It’s a complicated can of worms. Good luck getting a thorough, unbiased opinion from strangers on the Internet. The more you read about all the different political and religious factions involved in the Israel-Palentine conflict, the more you will find that it’s a tangled mess of alliances, political desires, religious convictions, and international proxy fights that reach back a century or more.
I felt like a safe default option is treating both HAMAS terracts and israeli oppression of palestinians as bad and continuously fueling each other. One is right-in-your-face brutal, one is rather impersonal and systemic. That’s the baseline.
Then, opinions start to differ by who is historically to blame there or who can affect this problem and try to solve it (without any final solution some radicals want). Israel is claimed to be that, in both cases but by different parties. Two major schools of sofa thoughts are either free Palestine (and I hope it’s also free from, not for fucking HAMAS of all people?) or Israel handling it whatever it takes and staying as a beacon of the international influence (control?) in the Middle East. Whatever, pick your poison.
There are influxes of hell knows what in discussing this ongoing shitstorm, from infantilizing palestinians to adoring the jewish ethnostate. I feel it’s vital not to engage in deciding the future for these groups of people having a bloody conflict we don’t really understand, but to support humanitarian causes, relief for those affected, and reaching out to those who can help freeze this conflict. It’s hard to talk over exploding munition.
This short documentary that David Hoffman uploaded sums the history up in an impartial manner.
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If you ask for the “Why” often enough, it always comes down to Antisemitism.
Israel wouldn’t exist if not for the unhinged antisemitism of German Nazis in the 1930/40s.
In the last 20 years, Israel found itself to need new settlements, with all the accompanying political changes and pressures. Why? - because many Jews from all over the world migrated there. Why? - Antisemitism in their home countries makes those a less habitable place than an Israel that is continuously on the brink of a war.
And this doesn’t even touch the rampant antisemitism in the Muslim world that wants to drive the Jews into the ocean and doesn’t accept a state Israel under any circumstances.
I don’t remember all the details but after, I think ww2, a bunch of land was promised to Israel but that same land was also promised to Palestine. Do these two groups had a claim to the same land to call their country.
It couldn’t just be divided in half as they both claimed some areas as their religious sites and didn’t want to give that up.
Eventually it was settled and the land was divided between the two countries. But through legal loopholes and stuff Israel was able to claim some additional land.
But the end result is that there are two groups who have been at each others throats forever.
I’m not from this region or have a say in it. The facts I stated are not entirely accurate, it’s just what I could remember at the moment from some video I watched at some point.
So, if you read or hear conflicting information just go with what the other person said.
If I got something wrong please post the correction.
If you are going to tell me that something is wrong and I shouldn’t post it because it’s misinformation, then fuck off. No one else has posted anything and I’m just trying to help out based on memory. If you can do a better job explaining it do it and I’ll delete my comment.
But through legal loopholes and stuff
The “stuff” part was violent military invasion payed by the US. Zionism has been a thing since the XIX century and illegal Jewish settlements have been occurring from even way before WW1. To the point that some Zionist groups even staged refugee ships and terrorist attacks to gather diplomatic support and fight the British and Palestinians for decades (including bombing civilian houses, razing villages and murdering children). When the US gave them financial back up at the end of the first Arab-Israeli war (which they only wanted out of imperialism to use Israel as a war dog against other Arab nations), they used it to turn their paramilitary groups into an official army and invaded all of the West Bank (and half of Egypt). The whole thing is fucked up beyond belief.
The Israelis and Palestinians are fighting over the same land because they both think it’s The Holy Land. The Palestinians had laid claim to it for hundreds of years (I think) and then the state of Israel took over the same land in 1950, which of course pissed off the Palestinians. Fighting ensued. The US, which is a massive military power backed the Israelis (because we have a bunch of Jews/Israelis with very deep pockets), which pissed off the Palestinians even more.
This is a vast oversimplification of about 70 years of massacres, death, and hatred on both sides. For the past 20 years or so, Israel has been incredibly brazen in its destruction of Palestine and colonization of Palestinian lands. At the same time, Palestine is literally controlled by a terrorist organization that is not even trying to attack military targets and instead seems set on some sort of vengeance (while using Palestinian citizens as human shields). So neither are good, and both seem set on genocide. If you had to pick one, stand with Palestine but denounce Hamas.
I also have no insight into this, but it seems like another political war.
Can you name a war that isn’t political? It’s kind of an inherent property of the concept
There’s also religious wars.
Religion is just politics with “because god said so,” even “justification” as* flimsy as Scotch tape in 98%humidity.
Corrected
