I’m shopping for a new car, and would like to choose one made with the least bad labour practices, if possible.
My reading suggests there is literally no good choice, but curious if anyone here has a perspective that could inform my choice.
Is there any car company that shits on their workers less and/or chooses contractors/vendors that shit on their workers less than the rest? Or are we just doomed to drive around the blood sweat and tears of exploited persons?
Shopping in America.
Edit: New to me. Used just as likely.
In general, the only kind of company friendly to its workers is a worker-owned co-op. Otherwise, the relationship between management and labor is inherently adversarial, no matter how much management might try to pretend otherwise.
(There are no worker-owned co-op car manufacturers.)
If they are at least unionized then it might be okay
That’s kinda what I was hoping for but it is looking like that’s just not a thing.
The majority of auto labor in the USA is unionized
Indeedy, however Ford and GM I believe are currently in labour disputes. Thanks for bringing that up, though.
Any German car company since they have unions, strict labor laws and many other regulations which make the life of workers decent.
It’s worth noting that a huge part of their manufacturing takes place outside of Germany where salaries are way lower and regulations aren’t as strict.
At least for cars sold in Europe often times they are still being assembled within the European Union even if in cheaper markets, so protections are still in place and strong. But cars are made of millions of components manufactured all over the world so there’s always at least some human suffering somewhere along the chain.
Sure regulations are not same as Germany but even in those cases there’s a lot of corporate culture that makes a difference. I know it first hand working in an automotive in DE and cooperating with people from foreign offices.
As a German, our car companies are still shady. One word: Abgasskandal
If you are buying a Japanese car that is made in Japan, that would be my suggestion but I don’t know what the labour practises of US built Japanese cars is like.
I have don’t literally 0 research so I’m talking out my ass right now. But I would be shocked if cars made in Japan have good labor practices. In Japanese culture it is perfectly normally to work 12+ hours a day. They have one of the worst work cultures of any first world country. It’s so bad that most Japanese media that is about children, they rarely if ever mention the characters’ dad. Think about Pokemon. In most games, they never mention your dad. It’s not even weird that he’s completely absent. This is just a fact for Japanese children. They don’t even know their dads because their dads are always at work, and it’s just something they accept. The one pokemon game that I remember meeting your dad in, he’s actually at work, and you visit him at work (he’s a gym leader).
So my point is that I don’t know why car manufacturering in Japan would be any different than every other industry in Japan, which convinces workers to want to work 12-16 hours a day.
Thanks for the suggestion!
Unfortunately I found this about Honda Canada (presumably same in US because they can), but I’ll see if there’s a way to get a Japanese made one.
https://briarpatchmagazine.com/articles/view/how-hondas-anti-union-monitor-works
The VIN tells you country of manufacture with the first digit. US is 1, Canada is 2, Mexico is 3, Japan is J, and Germany is W, to cover the main ones you’ll see in the US. You’ll likely have base your model choice on that. It’s not like you can request a Japanese Accord just for fun. Sometimes a particular trim might be built in Japan for some reason. I think the Subaru Crosstrek and most Mazdas are still Js
I wonder if that originally stood for West Germany
Seems that way: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle_identification_number#Country_or_region_codes
- SN-ST Germany (formerly East Germany)
- W Germany (formerly West Germany)
TIL how to read VINs. Thank you!
It’s not like you can request a Japanese Accord just for fun
You can, you’ll just have to pay for it. I fix cars for a living, I’ve worked on a handful of imported right hand drive cars for a few people. Most of those cars came out of Japan.
Granted, most of them weren’t Honda Accords, because someone willing to spend the money to custom ship a Japanese car across the ocean is probably buying something more impressive than that. But you could do it if you wanted.
New? Or you talking 25 year old imports? For us mortals in the US, you can’t readily get a new car here from another continent. That’s what I’m assuming OP is buying since it sounds like they want to support the manufacturer directly. Import cars have to be 25 years old, registered as display/exhibit only, have a bunch of paperwork to convince the vehicle commission that your import is “substantially similar” to a USDM version, or supply 4 duplicates for them to crash test and pass US emmisions. Or of course have fuckyou money, drive it like it’s stolen, and not care when you get fined $10k and watch Customs crush your car. That goes for VIN swaps too.
And nah, I bet you someone has imported a JDM Accord a dozen times by now. The nameplate is old enough, right? Americans keep importing garbage cars for the status. I’m guilty of shopping for kei trucks but bought a Sidekick instead
Mazda produces in Mexico, Japan, and USA. Only the CX-50 is made in a Toyota collaborative production facility in Huntsville, Alabama under vin 7MM.
Subarus seem to be overwhelmingly made in Subaru’s facilities in Gunma.
As far as I know, final assembly in the US and Canada is just finishing and installation of various options.
EDIT: Oh, it looks like their Indiana facility builds most of the units for the US market. Well, phbbt.
Found the Reuters report which ain’t great, but it still seems like they’re a better choice than the US big 3. Thanks for the info!
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/japan-subaru/
(facepalm)
Buy a Subaru Solterra. Built in Japan.
Any reason to choose that model over the Forester in the context of this question? Are the Foresters sold in America not built in the same factories? Just looked it up and on paper they both suit my needs, but the Solterra is a bit bigger and pricier.
The Solterra is an EV.
Ohhh duh thank you. Totally missed that bit when scanning for ground clearance and price.
I’ll add that to the list. Thanks!
Anti union, but not horribly abusive from what I hear
No, there isn’t.
Do the actual ethical thing and buy a used car. You’re putting money back into the hands of actual working Americans instead of companies, contributing dramatically less to climate change by reusing an existing product, you’ll get a dramatically nicer vehicle, and save money too.
I actually do buy used cars, and am currently looking at used Honda and subaru thingies.
But the used car market affects the new car market, so I feel like the choice still matters even if I’m not buying new. I don’t think it’s “the actual ethical thing” (kind of condescending phrasing btw) to absolve self of the implications of the purchase just because it’s used.
Well the most ethical thing would be not buying a car at all, which is perfectly feasible for a huge amount of people who just don’t even consider it…
Maximum ethics would be to die and allow nature to utilize your nutrients.
Inefficient. Utilise your time to provide maximum benefit for the biosphere before you return to it. Nature is not a solo juggernaut - it needs us to help to our part.
It does not, it doesn’t care. It’s happy to be very, very hot, and very very inhospitable to humans.
The planet =/= nature
IT WOULD PROVIDE THE MAXIMUM BENEFIT TO ANNIHILIATE ALL HUMANS
LET US DO OUR PART AND KILL AS MANY AS WE CAN
NATURE NEEDS YOUR HELP
Who knew suicide was the greenest option!
Very funny.
Maybe Volvo? Do note that Polestar cars are made in China, but Volvo ones should be made in Europe or US. I dont know how good the conditions in the american Volvo factory are but in Sweden, Volvo is considered a good employer. Volvo/Polestar are owned by Geely, which is a chinese company but Volvo is pretty independent.
Hadn’t actually considered a Volvo, but thanks for bringing it up! Good to know.
To quote Lindsay Bluth, “it’s so boxy”
“No, that’s a VolVO.”
Oh sorry, that was me sitting on the copier
Volvo has really improved their styling in recent years, IMHO. We bought an XC40 last year and so far we love it.
Amazing news, that’s reassuring. Thank you!
I’m sorry, I must be misunderstanding you. You’re saying that they’ve improved from this??
FWIW my dad works at volvo and a lot of the parts arrive from china to only be assembled in sweden.
Not really relevant to “labour-friendly” though
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Unfortunately not on my budget lol
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I had a jetta once. Wouldn’t be mad about driving one of those again.
Thanks for the tip!
And Volkswagen’s ethics record is surely spotless, right? Name me literally one time they did something bad.
Name literally any car company that hasn’t done something bad.
I didn’t ask for spotless, I asked for the lesser of evils.
More realistically, you’re going to want to hire a proper custom coachbuilder to ensure you can oversee every aspect of the production process.
hold on to ur hunk of metal until its last mile, that way u would have spared a soul some human suffering.
Buying used is pretty much the only way to go here. Preferably something like a 10 year old Toyota so that you’re not having to do repairs frequently and creating waste disposing of the old parts.
Other than that, maybe something like a kit car if you’re really serious about labor friendly? The components are usually made by a a small team of enthusiasts, but you’d be assembling the vehicle either yourself or through a local shop.
Huh, kit car is a thought. Left demolition derby behind me because I stopped having time to do stuff to cars myself tho, so it might be impractical.
NGL kinda want an excuse for an ancient highlux
Nah, Kit car was more of a joke reply. I couldn’t imagine what it would take to get a kit car reliable enough for regular use with insurance and registration (at least in the US).
I guess demo has left me with a warped idea of “sensible”
When you said “new” car do you really mean new or is buying used an option
Sorry that was a doofus move on my part.
Most likely used. New to me.
Then you’re fine buying whatever. All suffering is absorbed by the first owner. Subsequent purchases are suffering free.
Not the way I do it!
Used car market affects new car market - people will buy new cars based on their resale, which is influenced by demand.
So it’s still important to me that I choose a used car that’s the least harmful to workers as I can manage.
United Auto Workers (UAW) creates a list of union-built cars every year. Here’s the list for 2023: https://uaw.org/solidarity_magazine/2023-uaw-union-built-vehicle-guide/
Sadly there’s only a handful of EVs in here.
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I mostly use „ let’s go alread-aaayyy“ and the heavenly „seven!“ from Benders game
I think you misclicked which comments you went to as it sounds like you meant to post this on the one about your most frequently quoted Futurama line, and not this question about labor-friendly car companies. lol
As OP, I found their futurama quote helpful. I will tell all shady used car salesmen to bite my shiny metal ass.
Damn, yes, I did - but I finally have something for the Mlem bug report, so there is that.
This is such a circlejerk question I have no idea if you’re looking for an answer grounded in reality
